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Why all the hate towards Epilogue? - Disgruntled Artists

About Why all the hate towards Epilogue?

Previous Entry Why all the hate towards Epilogue? Jan. 18th, 2004 @ 01:52 am Next Entry
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From:(Anonymous)
Date:January 18th, 2004 05:17 pm (UTC)

unregistered madelf

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Wren,

I just stumbled across this site last night, following the same link you did, no doubt. I don't know if I'll bother registering here or not so I'll just be anonymous, but identified, for now. I'm sure you'll recognise the username in the subject.

Now you more-or-less know me. Not on a personal level of course, but you've read my posts at RPGnet, and possibly at Epilogue. We've even spoken by PM in the past. I trust that you realize I'm a pretty reasonable person.

With that said, yes. I've seen some pretty nasty comments here, and some direct attacks which I think anyone will agree is rude.
But I read through this entire site since I got here, and the overall tone is pretty civil. To my eye, this site is more of a support group than a hate fest. And it is very true that much of the animosity here is stirred up by Epilogue fans coming in with the distinct intention to raise a stink.

It is also true that these people have a grievance. It's not so much that things rejected and found in the WIP forum couldn't use more work, or improvement. From what I know of you, I think you'd be one of the first to agree that anyone's work always has room for improvement, regardless of experience.

The point these people are trying to make is that the rejection level isn't consistant. It's not about crying that their work should have been approved because it's perfect. It's about work that is many times worse than some things struggling in the WIP forum, being routinely approved. The trend is readily visible in the daily list of new art. The inconsistancy of the work accepted has been getting progressively worse over the couple of years I've been an Epilogue member, and it wasn't what I'd call great when I got there.

Certainly this is an opinion, but it is the opinion of many, and they are entitled to it. Bringing this issue up with the powers-that-be at Epilogue does not work. I've tried myself. Any questioning of the system, or suggestions for improving the quality of the review process are met with dismissal at best. My own courteous (and single) inquiry met with more than a little hostility.

The situation didn't bother me a great deal, so I just stopped hanging around as much. I figured, it's their site, they can ruin it if they want to. Other people are more concerned and dismayed. They wanted a place where they could discuss such issues without censorship (which they cannot do at Epilogue). So they created this place.

Like any fledgling enterprise, it's getting off to a rocky start. But the tone is improving. You can see it in the progression of the threads, if you care to. This site is maturing, and as it does, it may have the potential to be a very good thing. From what I've read, that's what they have in mind. We'll just have to wait and see. But in the meantime, please try not to judge these folks too harshly, or to judge all of them for the rudeness of a very few.

Thanks.
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From:flasher
Date:January 18th, 2004 09:50 pm (UTC)

Re: unregistered madelf

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Very well said, Madelf, very well said indeed.

After the initial "RAH RAH RAH I HATE EPILOGUE" type stuff, things here have settled out into a very reasonable discussion area. I'm not really taking part but I'm pleased to see the issues being raised here are getting talked about.

Personally, every time I've used Epi's "report this picture" link, I've been totally ignored. True, I've only done it twice but both times were with blatant photo manips of copyrighted material and both are still up to this day. I don't know why they say "report things" when nothing seems to happen if you do.
From:(Anonymous)
Date:January 19th, 2004 05:32 pm (UTC)

Re: unregistered madelf

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I'm just curious how often this happens - the report of an image being ignored that is. I've heard people mention that in previous threads here. Are images that violate copyright conciously being left up? Or are they simply under-staffed and just missing some of the reports?
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From:flasher
Date:January 20th, 2004 03:35 am (UTC)

Re: unregistered madelf

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I'm betting that removing images that don't fit falls pretty low on the priority queue as far as work for the mods go. Which would you rather do, peruse new art or go through old stuff that *might* be a copyright infringement? Since every reported image isn't automatically wrong, I bet the mods have to actually go hunting for the source material to back their decisions up when they remove something. That's a lot more work than just accepting/rejecting shit. Note, I'm not a mod, I don't know the actual process to which they must adhere when they try to get rid of an accepted piece, I'm just guessing.

One of the things I reported was a photo from a lunar landing...astronauts stepping down from the lander, that sort of thing. I looked and looked and I just couldn't find even additions to it. It was just one of NASA's pictures. Granted, those things might be public domain by now, I don't know but they didn't change anything. It wasn't painted freehand, I hunted out the original on NASA's web site and as far as I could tell, all they did was resize it. So I reported it. I went back about once a week for two months and it was still there. Still is for all I know. The other was a "fairy wings to magazine ad" thing.
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